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Germany's legion of NFL fans welcomes the 2-7 Giants and Panthers after Brady and Mahomes

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Germany's legion of NFL fans welcomes the 2-7 Giants and Panthers after Brady and Mahomes
Sport

Sport

Germany's legion of NFL fans welcomes the 2-7 Giants and Panthers after Brady and Mahomes

2024-11-09 22:45 Last Updated At:22:50

MUNICH (AP) — Tom Brady gave Germany its first taste of the NFL in 2022. Patrick Mahomes put on a show there last year.

This Sunday, Germany gets the Carolina Panthers and New York Giants, both with 2-7 records and short of star power. However, there's still an NFL buzz around Munich.

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Carolina Panthers quarterback Andy Dalton (14) throws a ball during practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The Carolina Panthers are set to play the New York Giants in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday Nov. 10. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

Carolina Panthers quarterback Andy Dalton (14) throws a ball during practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The Carolina Panthers are set to play the New York Giants in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday Nov. 10. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

Carolina Panthers players practice during a training session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The Carolina Panthers are set to play the New York Giants in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday Nov. 10. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

Carolina Panthers players practice during a training session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The Carolina Panthers are set to play the New York Giants in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday Nov. 10. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

Carolina Panthers running back Chuba Hubbard (30) and Carolina Panthers running back Jonathon Brooks (24) warm up with team mates for a practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The Carolina Panthers are set to play the New York Giants in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday Nov. 10. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

Carolina Panthers running back Chuba Hubbard (30) and Carolina Panthers running back Jonathon Brooks (24) warm up with team mates for a practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The Carolina Panthers are set to play the New York Giants in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday Nov. 10. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

New York Giants head coach Brian Daboll attends a news conference in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The New York Giants are set to play the Carolina Panthers in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Lennart Preiss)

New York Giants head coach Brian Daboll attends a news conference in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The New York Giants are set to play the Carolina Panthers in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Lennart Preiss)

Carolina Panthers quarterback Bryce Young (9) attends a news conference after a practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The Carolina Panthers are set to play the New York Giants in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday Nov. 10. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

Carolina Panthers quarterback Bryce Young (9) attends a news conference after a practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The Carolina Panthers are set to play the New York Giants in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday Nov. 10. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

Carolina Panthers cornerback Michael Jackson attends a news conference after a practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The Carolina Panthers are set to play the New York Giants in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday Nov. 10. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

Carolina Panthers cornerback Michael Jackson attends a news conference after a practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The Carolina Panthers are set to play the New York Giants in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday Nov. 10. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

New York Giants quarterback Daniel Jones (8) attends a news conference after a practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The New York Giants are set to play the Carolina Panthers in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Lennart Preiss)

New York Giants quarterback Daniel Jones (8) attends a news conference after a practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The New York Giants are set to play the Carolina Panthers in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Lennart Preiss)

New York Giants wide receiver Malik Nabers (1) attends a news conference after a practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The New York Giants are set to play the Carolina Panthers in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Lennart Preiss)

New York Giants wide receiver Malik Nabers (1) attends a news conference after a practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The New York Giants are set to play the Carolina Panthers in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Lennart Preiss)

New York Giants supporters queue outside the traditional 'Hofbraeuhaus' in Munich, Germany, Saturday, Nov. 9, 2024 ahead of the NFL match between the Carolina Panthers and the New York Giants in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

New York Giants supporters queue outside the traditional 'Hofbraeuhaus' in Munich, Germany, Saturday, Nov. 9, 2024 ahead of the NFL match between the Carolina Panthers and the New York Giants in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

Carolina Panthers supporters enjoy the day inside the traditional 'Augustiner' beer house in Munich, Germany, Saturday, Nov. 9, 2024 ahead of the NFL match between the Carolina Panthers and the New York Giants in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

Carolina Panthers supporters enjoy the day inside the traditional 'Augustiner' beer house in Munich, Germany, Saturday, Nov. 9, 2024 ahead of the NFL match between the Carolina Panthers and the New York Giants in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

New York Giants supporters enjoy the day inside the traditional 'Hofbraeuhaus' in Munich, Germany, Saturday, Nov. 9, 2024 ahead of the NFL match between the Carolina Panthers and the New York Giants in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

New York Giants supporters enjoy the day inside the traditional 'Hofbraeuhaus' in Munich, Germany, Saturday, Nov. 9, 2024 ahead of the NFL match between the Carolina Panthers and the New York Giants in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

People in Bavarian clothes pose with a NFL supporter inside the traditional 'Hofbraeuhaus' in Munich, Germany, Saturday, Nov. 9, 2024 ahead of the NFL match between the Carolina Panthers and the New York Giants in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

People in Bavarian clothes pose with a NFL supporter inside the traditional 'Hofbraeuhaus' in Munich, Germany, Saturday, Nov. 9, 2024 ahead of the NFL match between the Carolina Panthers and the New York Giants in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

Fans wearing caps and jerseys from almost every team in the league could be seen in the center of the city on Saturday. For Germany's growing community of NFL fans, the game means a chance to spend the weekend with people who share their passion.

Among the crowds on the historic Marienplatz square were Annika and Robert Peter, from Bonn in western Germany. They're Chiefs fans who saw the team beat the Dolphins 21-14 in Frankfurt last year, and they're going to Sunday's game to experience the NFL atmosphere a second time.

“We said that even if the Chiefs aren't here now, everything that goes with the game, the experience, is something special, too,” Annika Peter said. “It's a feeling of togetherness, no matter who the fans are. It's like a big family that comes together in the city to watch these games.”

As the NFL booms in international markets and sends more regular-season games overseas, there's the question of how much the quality of the product on the field really matters.

This year's game between the Giants and the Panthers — who are nominally the home team — reportedly sold out in just over 90 minutes when tickets went on sale in June. That was long before it became clear just how difficult the season would be for both teams.

However, in a sign of flagging enthusiasm from some fans, online platforms listed hundreds of tickets for resale Friday and Saturday and many were offered for around face value or even slightly less. It's far from the frenzy when Brady played at the same venue in 2022.

Another largely unsuccessful team is at the forefront of the NFL's global expansion plans. The Jacksonville Jaguars lead the league with 13 international games, all in London, since 2013, including two this season. The Jaguars have only made the playoffs twice in that time and, like the Giants and Panthers, are 2-7 this season.

Data from Sportfive, a marketing agency which works with the league, this year estimated 3.6 million Germans follow the NFL closely. Stefan Chatrath, professor of sports marketing at the University of Europe for Applied Sciences in Berlin, said the NFL’s appeal in Germany skewed toward a younger demographic even if older, wealthier fans tended to buy more tickets. With time, younger fans' influence will grow, he predicted.

“It’s to be expected that the full potential isn’t close to being realized yet,” said Chatrath, who added the teams are on the field are less important. “At the moment, the NFL brand is to the fore and that means it’s something special to be at an NFL game.”

One way the NFL tries to stand out from European sports is creating a sense of occasion around the game. Fans coming to Munich from across Europe are encouraged to make it a mini-vacation with NFL-themed events spread around the city. The 10 NFL teams with marketing rights in Germany have each taken over a Munich bar, some belonging to historic breweries, for fan parties and hospitality events this weekend.

The NFL’s emphasis on parity gives European fans of struggling teams like the Giants and Panthers particular hope, too. Some are tired of soccer, where the richest teams tend to monopolize the titles in national competitions and the Champions League.

Boris Helleu, a senior lecturer in sports marketing at the University of Caen Normandy in France, goes to NFL games in Europe. But he's also a fan of French soccer club Caen, which has yet to win a major trophy since it was founded 110 years ago.

“We have won nothing, nothing, nothing in our history. And I am very sure that when my time will come, I will never see my local team win something," Helleu said. The NFL offers something different, he added.

“When you are a fan of a weak (NFL) team, you can strongly believe that in five years you will be able, maybe, to win a championship."

AP NFL: https://apnews.com/hub/nfl

Carolina Panthers quarterback Andy Dalton (14) throws a ball during practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The Carolina Panthers are set to play the New York Giants in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday Nov. 10. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

Carolina Panthers quarterback Andy Dalton (14) throws a ball during practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The Carolina Panthers are set to play the New York Giants in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday Nov. 10. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

Carolina Panthers players practice during a training session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The Carolina Panthers are set to play the New York Giants in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday Nov. 10. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

Carolina Panthers players practice during a training session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The Carolina Panthers are set to play the New York Giants in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday Nov. 10. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

Carolina Panthers running back Chuba Hubbard (30) and Carolina Panthers running back Jonathon Brooks (24) warm up with team mates for a practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The Carolina Panthers are set to play the New York Giants in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday Nov. 10. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

Carolina Panthers running back Chuba Hubbard (30) and Carolina Panthers running back Jonathon Brooks (24) warm up with team mates for a practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The Carolina Panthers are set to play the New York Giants in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday Nov. 10. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

New York Giants head coach Brian Daboll attends a news conference in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The New York Giants are set to play the Carolina Panthers in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Lennart Preiss)

New York Giants head coach Brian Daboll attends a news conference in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The New York Giants are set to play the Carolina Panthers in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Lennart Preiss)

Carolina Panthers quarterback Bryce Young (9) attends a news conference after a practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The Carolina Panthers are set to play the New York Giants in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday Nov. 10. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

Carolina Panthers quarterback Bryce Young (9) attends a news conference after a practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The Carolina Panthers are set to play the New York Giants in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday Nov. 10. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

Carolina Panthers cornerback Michael Jackson attends a news conference after a practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The Carolina Panthers are set to play the New York Giants in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday Nov. 10. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

Carolina Panthers cornerback Michael Jackson attends a news conference after a practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The Carolina Panthers are set to play the New York Giants in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday Nov. 10. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

New York Giants quarterback Daniel Jones (8) attends a news conference after a practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The New York Giants are set to play the Carolina Panthers in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Lennart Preiss)

New York Giants quarterback Daniel Jones (8) attends a news conference after a practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The New York Giants are set to play the Carolina Panthers in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Lennart Preiss)

New York Giants wide receiver Malik Nabers (1) attends a news conference after a practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The New York Giants are set to play the Carolina Panthers in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Lennart Preiss)

New York Giants wide receiver Malik Nabers (1) attends a news conference after a practice session in Munich, Germany, Friday, Nov. 8, 2024. The New York Giants are set to play the Carolina Panthers in an NFL game at the Allianz Arena in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Lennart Preiss)

New York Giants supporters queue outside the traditional 'Hofbraeuhaus' in Munich, Germany, Saturday, Nov. 9, 2024 ahead of the NFL match between the Carolina Panthers and the New York Giants in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

New York Giants supporters queue outside the traditional 'Hofbraeuhaus' in Munich, Germany, Saturday, Nov. 9, 2024 ahead of the NFL match between the Carolina Panthers and the New York Giants in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

Carolina Panthers supporters enjoy the day inside the traditional 'Augustiner' beer house in Munich, Germany, Saturday, Nov. 9, 2024 ahead of the NFL match between the Carolina Panthers and the New York Giants in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

Carolina Panthers supporters enjoy the day inside the traditional 'Augustiner' beer house in Munich, Germany, Saturday, Nov. 9, 2024 ahead of the NFL match between the Carolina Panthers and the New York Giants in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

New York Giants supporters enjoy the day inside the traditional 'Hofbraeuhaus' in Munich, Germany, Saturday, Nov. 9, 2024 ahead of the NFL match between the Carolina Panthers and the New York Giants in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

New York Giants supporters enjoy the day inside the traditional 'Hofbraeuhaus' in Munich, Germany, Saturday, Nov. 9, 2024 ahead of the NFL match between the Carolina Panthers and the New York Giants in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

People in Bavarian clothes pose with a NFL supporter inside the traditional 'Hofbraeuhaus' in Munich, Germany, Saturday, Nov. 9, 2024 ahead of the NFL match between the Carolina Panthers and the New York Giants in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

People in Bavarian clothes pose with a NFL supporter inside the traditional 'Hofbraeuhaus' in Munich, Germany, Saturday, Nov. 9, 2024 ahead of the NFL match between the Carolina Panthers and the New York Giants in Munich on Sunday. (AP Photo/Matthias Schrader)

U.S. President Donald Trump says Iran has proposed negotiations after his threat to strike the Islamic Republic as an ongoing crackdown on demonstrators has led to hundreds of deaths.

Trump said late Sunday that his administration was in talks to set up a meeting with Tehran, but cautioned that he may have to act first as reports mount of increasing deaths and the government continues to arrest protesters.

“The meeting is being set up, but we may have to act because of what’s happening before the meeting. But a meeting is being set up. Iran called, they want to negotiate,” Trump told reporters on Air Force One on Sunday night.

Iran did not acknowledge Trump’s comments immediately. It has previously warned the U.S. military and Israel would be “legitimate targets” if America uses force to protect demonstrators.

The U.S.-based Human Rights Activists News Agency, which has accurately reported on past unrest in Iran, gave the death toll. It relies on supporters in Iran cross checking information. It said at least 544 people have been killed so far, including 496 protesters and 48 people from the security forces. It said more than 10,600 people also have been detained over the two weeks of protests.

With the internet down in Iran and phone lines cut off, gauging the demonstrations from abroad has grown more difficult. Iran’s government has not offered overall casualty figures.

The Latest:

A witness told the AP that the streets of Tehran empty at the sunset call to prayers each night.

Part of that stems from the fear of getting caught in the crackdown. Police sent the public a text message that warned: “Given the presence of terrorist groups and armed individuals in some gatherings last night and their plans to cause death, and the firm decision to not tolerate any appeasement and to deal decisively with the rioters, families are strongly advised to take care of their youth and teenagers.”

Another text, addressed “Dear parents,” which claimed to come from the intelligence arm of the paramilitary Revolutionary Guard, also directly warned people not to take part in demonstrations.

The witness spoke to the AP on condition of anonymity due to the ongoing crackdown.

—- By Jon Gambrell in Dubai, United Arab Emirates

Iran drew tens of thousands of pro-government demonstrators to the streets Monday in a show of power after nationwide protests challenging the country’s theocracy.

Iranian state television showed images of demonstrators thronging Tehran toward Enghelab Square in the capital.

It called the demonstration an “Iranian uprising against American-Zionist terrorism,” without addressing the underlying anger in the country over the nation’s ailing economy. That sparked the protests over two weeks ago.

State television aired images of such demonstrations around the country, trying to signal it had overcome the protests, as claimed by Iranian Foreign Minister Abbas Araghchi earlier in the day.

China says it opposes the use of force in international relations and expressed hope the Iranian government and people are “able to overcome the current difficulties and maintain national stability.”

Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesperson Mao Ning said Monday that Beijing “always opposes interference in other countries’ internal affairs, maintains that the sovereignty and security of all countries should be fully protected under international law, and opposes the use or threat of use of force in international relations.”

German Chancellor Friedrich Merz condemned “in the strongest terms the violence that the leadership in Iran is directing against its own people.”

He said it was a sign of weakness rather than strength, adding that “this violence must end.”

Merz said during a visit to India that the demonstrators deserve “the greatest respect” for the courage with which “they are resisting the disproportional, brutal violence of Iranian security forces.”

He said: “I call on the Iranian leadership to protect its population rather than threatening it.”

Iran’s Foreign Ministry spokesman on Monday suggested that a channel remained open with the United States.

Esmail Baghaei made the comment during a news conference in Tehran.

“It is open and whenever needed, through that channel, the necessary messages are exchanged,” he said.

However, Baghaei said such talks needed to be “based on the acceptance of mutual interests and concerns, not a negotiation that is one-sided, unilateral and based on dictation.”

The semiofficial Fars news agency in Iran, which is close to the paramilitary Revolutionary Guard, on Monday began calling out Iranian celebrities and leaders on social media who have expressed support for the protests over the past two weeks, especially before the internet was shut down.

The threat comes as writers and other cultural leaders were targeted even before protests. The news agency highlighted specific celebrities who posted in solidarity with the protesters and scolded them for not condemning vandalism and destruction to public property or the deaths of security forces killed during clashes. The news agency accused those celebrities and leaders of inciting riots by expressing their support.

Canada said it “stands with the brave people of Iran” in a statement on social media that strongly condemned the killing of protesters during widespread protests that have rocked the country over the past two weeks.

“The Iranian regime must halt its horrific repression and intimidation and respect the human rights of its citizens,” Canada’s government said on Monday.

Iran’s foreign minister claimed Monday that “the situation has come under total control” after a bloody crackdown on nationwide protests in the country.

Abbas Araghchi offered no evidence for his claim.

Araghchi spoke to foreign diplomats in Tehran. The Qatar-funded Al Jazeera satellite news network, which has been allowed to work despite the internet being cut off in the country, carried his remarks.

Iran’s foreign minister alleged Monday that nationwide protests in his nation “turned violent and bloody to give an excuse” for U.S. President Donald Trump to intervene.

Abbas Araghchi offered no evidence for his claim, which comes after over 500 have been reported killed by activists -- the vast majority coming from demonstrators.

Araghchi spoke to foreign diplomats in Tehran. The Qatar-funded Al Jazeera satellite news network, which has been allowed to work despite the internet being cut off in the country, carried his remarks.

Iran has summoned the British ambassador over protesters twice taking down the Iranian flag at their embassy in London.

Iranian state television also said Monday that it complained about “certain terrorist organization that, under the guise of media, spread lies and promote violence and terrorism.” The United Kingdom is home to offices of the BBC’s Persian service and Iran International, both which long have been targeted by Iran.

A huge crowd of demonstrators, some waving the flag of Iran, gathered Sunday afternoon along Veteran Avenue in LA’s Westwood neighborhood to protest against the Iranian government. Police eventually issued a dispersal order, and by early evening only about a hundred protesters were still in the area, ABC7 reported.

Los Angeles is home to the largest Iranian community outside of Iran.

Los Angeles police responded Sunday after somebody drove a U-Haul box truck down a street crowded with the the demonstrators, causing protesters to scramble out of the way and then run after the speeding vehicle to try to attack the driver. A police statement said one person was hit by the truck but nobody was seriously hurt.

The driver, a man who was not identified, was detained “pending further investigation,” police said in a statement Sunday evening.

Shiite Muslims hold placards and chant slogans during a protest against the U.S. and show solidarity with Iran in Lahore, Pakistan, Sunday, Jan. 11, 2026. (AP Photo/K.M. Chaudary)

Shiite Muslims hold placards and chant slogans during a protest against the U.S. and show solidarity with Iran in Lahore, Pakistan, Sunday, Jan. 11, 2026. (AP Photo/K.M. Chaudary)

Activists carrying a photograph of Reza Pahlavi take part in a rally supporting protesters in Iran at Lafayette Park, across from the White House, in Washington, Sunday, Jan. 11, 2026. (AP Photo/Jose Luis Magana)

Activists carrying a photograph of Reza Pahlavi take part in a rally supporting protesters in Iran at Lafayette Park, across from the White House, in Washington, Sunday, Jan. 11, 2026. (AP Photo/Jose Luis Magana)

Activists take part in a rally supporting protesters in Iran at Lafayette Park, across from the White House in Washington, Sunday, Jan. 11, 2026. (AP Photo/Jose Luis Magana)

Activists take part in a rally supporting protesters in Iran at Lafayette Park, across from the White House in Washington, Sunday, Jan. 11, 2026. (AP Photo/Jose Luis Magana)

Protesters burn the Iranian national flag during a rally in support of the nationwide mass demonstrations in Iran against the government in Paris, Sunday, Jan. 11, 2026. (AP Photo/Michel Euler)

Protesters burn the Iranian national flag during a rally in support of the nationwide mass demonstrations in Iran against the government in Paris, Sunday, Jan. 11, 2026. (AP Photo/Michel Euler)

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